Coerce? Trump had no power or ability to coerce Raffensperger, and they both knew it. You can't coerce someone under those circumstances. All you can do is make request. Which is what Trump did. But of course, MSM wouldn't want to admit that legal experts know the law better than they, the journalists, do. Quite frankly, I'd like to see some of these journalists taken to court, for they are essentially giving legal advice without a law license, which is malpractice. BTW, since October my prayer has been specifically that our Lord would grant us a fair and honest election result. He knows what that is, better than we know. (Unfortunately, some prayers wind up being answered with a "no" for various reasons known to Him.)
For Our Country. ALMIGHTY God, who hast given us this good land for our heritage; We humbly beseech thee that we may always prove ourselves a people mindful of thy favour and glad to do thy will. Bless our land with honourable industry, sound learning, and pure manners. Save us from violence, discord, and confusion; from pride and arrogancy, and from every evil way. Defend our liberties, and fashion into one united people the multitudes brought hither out of many kindreds and tongues. Endue with the spirit of wisdom those to whom in thy Name we entrust the authority of government, that there may be justice and peace at home, and that, through obedience to thy law, we may show forth thy praise among the nations of the earth. In the time of prosperity, fill our hearts with thankfulness, and in the day of trouble, suffer not our trust in thee to fail; all which we ask through Jesus Christ our Lord. Amen.
You may object to my word "Coerce" but it is clear that the call and attempt to pressure Raffensperger...........And let's not turn a blind eye. The whole tone, message and implication of the phone call was to persuade SOS to "Find" those votes by any means possible. It is not appropriate for a president to or any candidate to plead, beg, demand SOS to "Find" votes while spewing debunked and false conspiracies; others will investigate whether it is criminal or not.
All I can tell you is admin admonished me that it is not the forum's job to create partisan divisions. I quite agree. It should have been clear to anyone reading it that the point of the post was to ask for prayer. It may have been very poorly worded, but I cannot help being too stupid to properly compose a post. And discouraging prayer for one another for any reason is not in alignment with the Word in my opinion. I am tying up a few posts while waiting for Admin to delete my account.
Discouraging prayer was the least intended thing, especially during this tough time for our country. Please accept my apologies if that came through, and likewise please do not take anything personally. The only reason the other thread was closed was, it sprang up as partisan, and it seemed as if it would stay that way and so the wisest move appeared to be to preempt further escalation. Please use this thread to offer up any prayers. Let's keep all of the Christian brothers and sisters above any passing, temporal, temporary wranglings which are ultimately a speck in God's time anyway.
and yet These are the things and events that happen when a sacred landslide election victory is so unceremoniously & viciously stripped away from great patriots who have been badly & unfairly treated for so long. Go home with love & in peace. Remember this day forever! Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) January 6, 2021 I would have no doubt that there is an element in most Western Societies that enjoys significant protest and in being part of the action, and essentially the substance and the cause is not the issue. In Australia we suggest that these are the people who will come out and protest Land Rights for Gay Whales! Certainly some of the images and footage suggest that some of these may have been part of it. Given the enormity of Police Presence for the BLM Protest it does seem remarkable the Capitol Building has such light security during a sitting of both houses of the US Parliament. I also note that I have seen no indication that protesters were carrying firearms and the only ones I saw were in the hands of those defending the building. #1 reason why Trump supporters are highly unlikely to have caused this violence is because they have nothing to gain and everything to lose by becoming violent. And yet The Trump Supporters organised a Rally in the near precinct of the Capitol on the days that the cotes were being counted which provided the opportunity for the madness and mayhem that followed. #2 reason is that Trump supporters are almost all law-and-order types, highly respectful of the law and police; they are the people who "Back the Blue." And yet we have seem many images over the last couple of years that suggest that there are numbers of Trump supporters who are not so respectful. I have met many people who are as you describe, however there are many others who are not. Antifa and other left wing extremists are the ones who notoriously support defunding the police and who act out with unlawful violence in demonstrations! Trump gained office on the mantra 'Make America Great Again' which clearly offers a significant rallying cry for those who have been left out as the distribution of capital moves and increases the economic divide, whilst jobs and manufacturing, and even agriculture has moved offshore. As such it is popularism, and it seems that much of the past 4 years has been marked by photo opportunities, tweets, and in many ways to the outsider it has seemed like a Reality TV Show Presidency. That being said, I also recognise that the US has achieved in the Middle East some of the most significant progress towards the possibility of peace. I also noticed that there seemed to be very little damage being done in and to the Capitol, and no great looting going on, both of which I would have expected had this been an Antifa event. I know that many in the US cherish an understanding of the 2nd amendment, and like most in the world I have given up thinking that the Americans will ever concede the folly of having one of the most highly armed civilian populations on the planet, that being said, I am envious of the first amendment.
Certainly, on its face the request sounds tacky, tactless, and possibly unethical. But let's consider it from the opposite point of view. One of the allegations concerning the GA count was that a witness said she saw a vote tallying machine take votes manually entered for Trump and change the votes on-screen to Biden votes. If you were Trump and if you believed this eyewitness' account, would you feel bad about asking authorities to find those votes (which you believe should rightfully be your votes) and correct them? At least we hopefully can agree that persuasion and even 'political pressure' are not illegal. I hope you stick around. The very reason for keeping all the political disagreements in just one thread is the reason why the admin wanted to (out of superabundance of caution) "head off at the pass" the new thread; we probably would have wound up kicking and abusing it eventually and taking the thread far afield from its stated purpose (prayer). Stay with us. If there's someone you don't want to see any posts from (like me, for example), use the "ignore" feature.
Well, it's over. The 'fat lady has sung.' The votes are finalized and Pres. Trump has said there will be an orderly transition on Jan. 20. I find Nancy Pelosi's behavior particularly heinous. Despite Trump accepting defeat, she is calling on Pence to invoke the 25th Amendment and have Trump removed from office before Jan. 20, on the absurd grounds that he "incited an armed insurrection." A hundred thousand peaceful demonstrators (who were calmly listening to a speech) are besmirched by the misbehavior of a handful of idiots, we don't even know if these idiots were armed, and this is an "armed insurrection"? Pelosi likes to kick a man when he's down, obviously. I will make a prediction. The Deep State will not be satisfied with having the socialist Democrats take control of the executive and legislative branches. They have such hatred in them, I predict that they will destroy Trump. They will have him locked up in prison for life and will take every penny he owns before they're through with him. They just can't stand to even see him exist.
I can't understand why Americans use this sort of voting system. I would always be suspicious of my vote going into some sort of computer. I much prefer our low tech system, filling out a form folding it up and putting it in a box with all the others at the booth, and later the counters adding them all up under the eagle eyes of scrutineers (like Tiffy). Presumable these votes after counting are sealed up in their box for rechecking later should the need arise. Rexlion's witness says she saw the screen change votes from Trump to Biden, does this mean she could see how some people voted to know they were changed? Or is there always a running tally of how many votes a candidate has gained? Which is something we don't have. All votes are counted only after voting finishes.
But what exactly was it that Trump was tacitly 'requesting' him to do for him? That is the question. "Find enough votes to get him in by 1 vote". We even know how many votes Trump wanted 'found' in order to reach that 'result'. I think you should realise that a 'request' from the President of the USA is tantamount to a command from anyone else in the USA, surely, or have things gotten so different over there since Trump got into power? Have you considered, (given that every spurious legal challenge brought by Trump and his team has been tossed out and no evidence of fraudulent counts have been uncovered), that perhaps, just maybe, your PRAYER has already been answered with a resounding OK, but you simply have not liked God's answer, so refuse to accept it, just like Trump? Why assume, in the face of all the evidence, (and only on Trump's say so), that God has said NO to your and Trumps election dream. It wasn't God's decision anyway. God didn't have a vote. .
I think Trump was unfit for office from day 1 of his presidency. 20 more days of having an unstable narcisist potus are a risk too far in my opinion. Particularly now he is so obviously coming apart and scared of losing presidencial immunity from prosecution for multiple misdemenours we have yet to discover whether he is indeed guilty of because he can't be charged while he's in office. This is quite apart from the dangerous fact that he still has overall command of the nuclear arsenal of the most poweful nation in the world. If for that reason alone they could lock him comfortably in a padded cell with some nurses to take care of him and a reasonably sane vice President take over, we would all sleep easier during the next 20 days. Rarely before in the field of US politics has a man so obviously unfit for office, for so long, remained in it. Now this: .
Here’s a post describing some of my feelings on how things are in the US copied from the Episcopal Church sub Reddit. I posted it in response to the moment of prayer from Washington National Cathedral yesterday: A good message and prayer. Although I have to say, as a Republican myself, those that stormed the Capitol yesterday were not Republicans, even if they claim to be. This issue, our divisiveness goes beyond party lines. I do hope that the same that are grieving and are enraged by the acts that were perpetrated yesterday, were just as enraged and grieved by the riots that took place this last year around the country, for there is no difference...we Americans need to get back to being united. We are the UNITED States of America, after all. As a conservative, I no doubt have many differences with many of you on this platform when it comes to politics, and that is okay. I welcome those differences, and they will be “fought” out in the political area, with respect and dignity. But what’s been going on in this country is distinctly un-American and needs to stop. Like I said, this goes beyond party lines, beyond our differences..we are ALL Americans, no matter what race, color, or creed. We need to start acting like it. We also need to turn to God, for he is the one who holds this whole world in his hands, and through Jesus Christ, our Lord, we are saved. You really want to change the world?...listen to the words that Jesus told his disciples. “Follow me”....
Apparently there were ballots from overseas-stationed troops, citizens of Georgia, who had to more or less 'fax' them in. These woudn't feed into the machine, so a poll worker was assigned to enter the information into the machine manually off the faxed 'ballot'. I fully agree, a low tech system would be greatly preferable. And a return to minimal numbers of allowed absentee ballots, too, because the potential for fraud with absentee ballots has been well-documented and discussed for years. This year, Covid was utilized to broadcast vast numbers of absentee ballots and they were accepted without keeping the signed envelopes with them as the law requires.
Indeed. If only we had heard equal denouncements of the violence and deaths perpetrated last summer, at the time they were occurring, from supporters of those movements.
You do make a valid point. I would point out that this so called witness was trotted out in one of the lawsuits and it was proved that she didn't know what she was taking about. Also in regard to the Dominion machine changing votes on screen; didn't happen. The reason they know this is because the machine prints out a paper copy at the end. During count, the machine internal tally is matched to the paper copy tally. If machine were flipping votes, the paper tally and the machine tally would disagree. There were no discrepancies. So while I agree that Trump had every right to question all elections, enough is enough. 60+ lawsuits, 86 different judges (some of them Trump appointees) could not find any credible evidence, witnesses, or affidavits of widespread fraud. The most secure, investigated and litigated election in American History. After all this scrutiny it is time to admit the truth and stop inciting your cult followers to violent overthrown of the government.
Good news at last. Amazing how the threat of the 25th amendment can suddenly make somebody behave more rationally. Then again it could also be a response to this prayer or this one. Prayer is a mysterious phenomenon. Perhaps positive answers to it from God depend upon a unity of purpose in line with the will of God, who is Truth. Matt.18:19. James 1:4-8. .
I find it puzzling though that Trump supporters seem to have 'uncovered' so much appearently 'obvious' voting fraud, when official inquiries conducted by legal officials installed by a Trump adminstation of the last 4 years could find nothing at all sufficient to have affected the election result. Not a single spurious accusation has been officially upheld. Perhaps the conspiracy is more than just a theory, but this is one GIGANTIC conspiracy theory though. That must take a huge amount of mental energy to keep metaphorically erect in the mind. If it were my imaginary delusion I'd give up, roll over and go to sleep. It's not worth the mental viagra or the cerebral effort to keep it going, and a good night's sleep might reestablish rationality the following morning. .