Pope Francis new encyclical (Fratelli tutti): denies just war theory, celebrates communism

Discussion in 'Non-Anglican Discussion' started by Stalwart, Oct 7, 2020.

  1. Ananias

    Ananias Member Anglican

    Posts:
    95
    Likes Received:
    62
    Country:
    USA
    Religion:
    ACNA
    Perhaps. But a man may die of a bad tooth if the bad tooth is not extracted. At some point a failure to take action is an action in itself.
     
  2. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

    Posts:
    1,295
    Likes Received:
    1,476
    Country:
    Australia
    Religion:
    Anglican
    The current climate of political rhetoric is less enlightening than it should be. Being the leader (shepherd, pastor, bishop) of either of the communions to which we are referring is without doubt difficult, demanding and challenging. When they speak, I am more than happy to agree or disagree as I see fit. This position should be based on the evidence, and our discussion should be about the content rather than the person.

    We worship one God, we read (in the main) one Bible, and we confess (in the main) one creed. When Francis became Pope my expectations were few, and as time has progressed I see how has has shone Gospel light in many places where it was not able to be seen before. When Justin ascended the steps to the chair of Augustine I admit to a level of concern, yet as time has passed I have seen more than I imagined I would see, as he tries to lead a communion which in many ways seems intent on tearing itself apart.

    The incredible damage we do to the cause of Christ by endless derisory attacks on our leadership is not a good thing.

    Episcopacy is an excellent form of ecclesial governance only mucked up by having bishops. We are challenged to believe in Bishops, pray for and support our Bishops, always aware of the fundamental truth that they may be wrong some of the time. And in due humility we must be prepared to acknowledge at time that we ourselves may be wrong in part.

    I don't think it is, reasonable to suggest that either Francis or Justin represent a rotting tooth.
     
    Curious likes this.
  3. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

    Posts:
    1,274
    Likes Received:
    626
    Country:
    USA
    Religion:
    Christian
    It might be worth remembering that Bergoglio a/k/a Francis is also a Jesuit, and is the first Jesuit to become Pope.

    The oath sworn by every Jesuit includes this bit:
    ...I do further declare the doctrine of the Church of England, of the Calvanists (sic), the Huguenots, and other Protestants to be damnable and those to be damned who will not forsake the same. I do further declare that I will help, assist, and advise all or any of His Holiness agents in any place wherever I shall be; and to do my utmost to extirpate the heretical Protestant doctrine, and to destroy all their pretended power...​
     
  4. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

    Posts:
    1,295
    Likes Received:
    1,476
    Country:
    Australia
    Religion:
    Anglican
    Interesting. I tried to validate this. Whist it is vehemently attested by a number of anti catholic sources, I really could a jesuit source affirming that this is still used. The last parish I was in was next door to a Jesuit Parish, and it was not in evidence that they held such views, and at one stage gave the Anglican Parish a large commissioned Icon of All Saints as a token of gratitude and affection.

    As I understand it their vows are poverty chastity and obedience (no money, no honey, no funny business).
     
    Curious likes this.
  5. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

    Posts:
    1,274
    Likes Received:
    626
    Country:
    USA
    Religion:
    Christian
    No, I don't suppose the Jesuits would willingly admit to something like that. One might as well have expected Bill Clinton to admit, back in the '90s, that he'd had relations with Monica Lewinsky. ;)
     
  6. Stalwart

    Stalwart Well-Known Member Anglican

    Posts:
    1,573
    Likes Received:
    1,532
    Country:
    America
    Religion:
    Anglican
    From the same RC website which calls Francis the antipope, a few other morsels about our friend Francis the First:


    "Spanish Freemasonry cheers Francis’ New Encyclical on Human Fraternity"
    https://novusordowatch.org/2020/10/brothers-all-spanish-freemasonry-cheers-fratelli-tutti/

    "This should come as absolutely no surprise: On Oct. 5, 2020, only one day after the release of “Pope” Francis’ latest encyclical letter, Fratelli Tutti, the Grand Orient Freemasons of Spain published a statement praising the “papal” document for its adoption and propagation of Freemasonic ideas:
    "The latest encyclical of Pope Francis shows how far the current Catholic Church is from its former positions. In ‘Fratelli Tutti’, the Pope embraces the Universal Fraternity, the great principle of Modern Freemasonry."


    "French Socialist Leader applauds Encyclical ‘Fratelli Tutti’ "
    https://novusordowatch.org/2020/10/french-socialist-leader-applauds-fratelli-tutti/

    "After the Freemasonic Grand Orient Lodge of Spain gave its endorsement, another enemy of Roman Catholicism has voiced his support for “Pope” Francis’ new encyclical Fratelli Tutti, on human fraternity and social friendship. We are talking about Jean-Luc Mélenchon, the founder and current leader of the French socialist political movement La France Insoumise (“Insubordinate France”), which enjoys the support of the French Communist Party... Regarding the “neoliberal economic model” Francis critiques in Fratelli Tutti, Melenchon notes: “His words sound similar enough to my own, so they move me.” "
     
  7. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

    Posts:
    1,274
    Likes Received:
    626
    Country:
    USA
    Religion:
    Christian
    Perhaps Francis will soon be able to unite all people of faiths into one big, universal religion based on the in-common threads of spiritualism, social justice and ecological preservation.

    :doh:
     
  8. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

    Posts:
    1,295
    Likes Received:
    1,476
    Country:
    Australia
    Religion:
    Anglican
    Lord, make me an instrument of Your peace;
    Where there is hatred, let me sow love;
    Where there is injury, pardon;
    Where there is discord, harmony;
    Where there is error, truth;
    Where there is doubt, faith;
    Where there is despair, hope;
    Where there is darkness, light;
    And where there is sadness, joy.

    O Divine Master, Grant that I may not so much seek
    To be consoled as to console;
    To be understood as to understand;
    To be loved as to love.

    For it is in giving that we receive;
    It is in pardoning that we are pardoned;
    And it is in dying that we are born to eternal life.
     
    Curious and Moses like this.