Church and forum unity

Discussion in 'Announcements' started by Admin, Apr 23, 2013.

  1. Dave

    Dave Active Member

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    Part of the genius of the Anglican Church is that is broad to some extent. That can be a good thing. Too often certain denominations try to hold that their view of salvation (and atonement) is the real gospel and only they have the whole truth. The bible and Christ's saving actions often have multiple levels of meaning.
    (Of course one can be so broad as to not have any meaning nor structure)

    As Anglicans:
    1) Confess the Nicene & Apostles Creed
    2) From the preface for the current season: Jesus Chirst "... is the true Paschal Lamb, who was sacrificed for us, and has taken away the sin of the world. By his death he has destroyed death, and by his rising to life again he has won for us everlasting life."

    3) Liturgical
    4) Instruments and Choirs are allowed
    5) Our church hierarchy is 3-fold: deacon, priest, bishop
     
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  2. Admin

    Admin Administrator Staff Member Typist Anglican

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    Let's reaffirm the goal here. We are trying to 1) formulate a standard of unity, 2) without preventing anybody from participating. The last thing we want to do is differentiate between corporate bodies like TEC and ACNA, especially as both are seeking regularization in the communion. It is not our place to validate membership or dictate between these or even other bodies.

    What we can do is have a standard, wherever users may find themselves at the moment.

    That being said, you are asked not to try to get your personal views enshrined. Dave says he wants a 3-fold hierarchy of deacons priests and bishops, but some else may want to maintain episcopacy as adiaphora. Who's to say? We need something better than personal opinions of those who happened to be members at present. What if a month from now there will be an influx of users from Belief Camp X (contrary to yours), and they will seek a regularization of their personal views instead?

    In summary this will not be an enshrinement of anyone's personal thoughts. You are asked to dig deep and present authenticly Anglican views, even if you may disagree with them. You are asked to prepare to be flexible in your views in general.
     
  3. Gordon

    Gordon Well-Known Member

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    That being the case the only thing we can use as the base line is Scripture, Creeds and Councils as the BCP and the 39 Articles are post reformation so the base line must be Scripture, Creeds, and Councils. IMHO
     
  4. Dave

    Dave Active Member

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    Which councils though... The first 4 or all 7
     
  5. Gordon

    Gordon Well-Known Member

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    OK so that just leaves Scripture and the Creeds.....
     
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  6. Symphorian

    Symphorian Well-Known Member

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    I think this quote from ++John Sentamu is particularly relevant:

    'Essential to Anglicanism is a sense of magnanimity/'moderation' - a holding together, often in creative tension, of different emphases or points of view, but always in a spirit of charity and appreciative enquiry.'


    Some ideas which I've shamelessly adapted from the Church of England's website:

    The foundations of Anglican faith and worship are Holy Scripture, the Apostolic Church and the early Church Fathers.

    We are part of the One, Holy, Catholic and Apostolic Church. We worship the one true God, who is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

    We uphold the Catholic and Apostolic faith uniquely revealed in the Holy Scripture and interpreted in light of Christian tradition, scholarship, reason and experience.

    We profess our faith through the Apostle's Creed, Nicene Creed and Athanasian Creed.

    We maintain the traditional three fold order of Bishops, Priests and Deacons.

    We aim to bring the grace of God to the world through word and sacrament in the power of the Holy Spirit.

    By baptism in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit, we are made one with Christ and received into the fellowship of the Church. Baptism is open to children as well as to adults.

    Central to worship for Anglicans is the celebration of the Holy Eucharist, also called the Holy Communion, the Lord's Supper or the Mass. In this offering of prayer and praise, the life, death and resurrection of Jesus Christ are recalled through the proclamation of the word and the celebration of the sacrament. Other important rites, commonly called sacraments, include confirmation, holy orders, reconciliation, marriage and anointing of the sick.

    We are a comprehensive Church with broad traditions:
    • The Evangelical tradition emphasizing the significance of the Protestant aspects of Anglicanism, stressing the importance of the authority of Scripture, preaching, justification by faith and personal conversion.
    • The Catholic tradition, strengthened and reshaped from the 1830s by the Oxford movement, emphasizing the significance of the continuity of the Church from the Early and Medieval periods. It has stressed the importance of the visible Church and its sacraments and the belief that the ministry of Bishops, Priests and Deacons is a sign and instrument of the Church's Catholic and Apostolic identity.
    • The Liberal tradition emphasizing the importance of the use of reason in theological exploration. It has stressed the need to develop Christian belief and practice in order to respond creatively to wider advances in human knowledge and understanding and the importance of social and political action in forwarding God's kingdom.
    • The Charismatic tradition emphasizing the importance of the Church being open to renewal through the work of the Holy Spirit. Its roots lie in Evangelicalism but it has influenced people from a variety of different traditions.
     
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  7. Scottish Monk

    Scottish Monk Well-Known Member

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    In my humble opinion, the Anglican Communion has become too broad in doctrine. We have become more concerned with the scratching of itching ears than the teaching of sound doctrine. Moreover, we need to select specific sources for the foundation of sound doctrine--the reading of which will leave no doubt as to the length, width, and depth of our forum's foundation--and will serve as a irrefutable checklist of what we believe and stand for, and stand against. Thus, when the influx of users from Belief Camp X visit the forum they will quickly learn what is acceptable and what is unacceptable here on our forum.
     
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  8. Spherelink

    Spherelink Active Member

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    Hmmm yes. A backbone is what we've lacked...
     
  9. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Active Member

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    I hate that my megapost was destroyed in the chaos. I'm trying to find the motivation to rewrite it :D
     
  10. Gordon

    Gordon Well-Known Member

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    Here in lies the problem - not everyone can agree on what the sources are for the foundation of sound doctrine...
     
  11. Peteprint

    Peteprint Well-Known Member Anglican

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    An excellent summary of the problem. If I might note though, even the commentaries we have, the writings of theologians, and the writings of the Church Fathers, are all of the nature of personal opinions. That's all we have to work with. I try to look for a consensus on a given issue.
     
  12. Scottish Monk

    Scottish Monk Well-Known Member

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    And not agreeing--that is the real problem.
     
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  13. Stalwart

    Stalwart Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Totally agree SK. We are so caught up in our own views that we prefer them over the opinions of the Church.
     
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  14. Gordon

    Gordon Well-Known Member

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    Exactly - that is why the Church is so fractured today and fracturing more every day... If this is any hope of a united Church of Christ it must start with mutual respect for all belief systems. The meat of the belief is there (we believe in a loving God) it always gets down to arguing about the peas.
     
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  15. Gordon

    Gordon Well-Known Member

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    That is exactly what we are trying to determine - it seems we cannot decide on what the baseline doctrine of the Church is.
     
  16. Stalwart

    Stalwart Well-Known Member Anglican

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    well that's discouraging.
     
  17. Robert

    Robert Active Member

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    To me it sounds like we are looking for a uniformity that has never existed in the history of Christianity. Even if you take scripture for example you will have endless debates on what it means and how it should be interpreted as we saw with our discussion on Genesis. If everyone interpreted Scripture the same way I doubt we would have needed councils or creeds.
     
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  18. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Active Member

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    Short version of my megapost. :D I believe that Anglican unity is found in our history, the theology that we profess on Sundays, our Sacraments, and our Anglican culture & distinctives.

    1. The Creeds - especially the Nicene and Apostles'. I don't care about filioque, because the Nicene Creed is true in both forms. I don't care if the Athanasian Creed is used or not (for forum purposes).

    2. The Ecumenical Councils. For catholic reasons, I believe that we should acknowledge all Seven.

    3. The Authority of Scripture. It should be recognized, and its place should be maintained. At the same time, Tradition does play an authoritative role in Anglicanism - and the extent of its role can vary. All Anglicans should respect that fact as well.

    4. The Book of Common Prayer. The 1662 is generally recognized as the standard BCP. However, due to our differing jurisdictions, most of us use other BCPs or liturgical texts. Those texts are authentically Anglican, even if their theological emphases differ. We respect the breadth of Anglican belief, as found in our BCPs and other authorized texts. We recognize that some aspects of these texts are open to interpretation, but that interpretation should be shaped by Scripture, Tradition, and the guidance of the theologians of the Church.

    5.Anglican Distinctives. We respect and support the things that make us Anglican. Some examples include our liturgical worship, our Sacramental theology & practices, and Apostolic Succession.
     
  19. The Dark Knight

    The Dark Knight Active Member

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    I really think that a lot of unity is built through our devotional practices and worship participation, but I have no idea how that would translate to a forum. :D
     
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  20. Gordon

    Gordon Well-Known Member

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    Agree with you DK but I still have some issues with the way the 39 Articles are thrown around to try and score points in a discussion.