Vatican stamp

Discussion in 'Non-Anglican Discussion' started by Aidan, Nov 16, 2017.

  1. Aidan

    Aidan Well-Known Member

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    The Vatican have issued a €1 stamp to commemorate the reformation. It depicts Christ crucified with Luther and Melancthon at the foot of the cross instead of Our Lady and St James
     
  2. anglican74

    anglican74 Well-Known Member Anglican

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    :o
    That's significant
     
  3. Lowly Layman

    Lowly Layman Well-Known Member Anglican

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    semper reformanda I suppose
     
  4. SirPalomides

    SirPalomides Active Member

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    Unfortunate.
     
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  5. Lowly Layman

    Lowly Layman Well-Known Member Anglican

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    In what way?
     
  6. Aidan

    Aidan Well-Known Member

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    A sign of the times and the Bergoglio pontificate. While some Anglicans want to be more Catholic,more evidence to suggest that Francis wants the Church to be less Catholic.
     
    Last edited: Nov 17, 2017
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  7. anglican74

    anglican74 Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I mean wouldn't you say that if the Roman Church had listened to Luther it would have not traveled the road it did? A road which it itself later abandoned? Catholics sometimes act like Trent was another Pentecost.. they forget that there was a Church before Trent! And now there is a Church that has moved past Trent.. it's one of the Anglican arguments against Infalliblity, but anyway..


    Look the modern Roman church has adopted the view of Justification for which it tried to get Luther burned and excommunicated. This has happened in 1999, long before anything Pope Francis has done...

    It seems to me that basically Luther was right on his main points, and when you move past biases and prejudices the modern church has basically accepted that.
     
  8. BibleHoarder

    BibleHoarder Active Member

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    As much as I'd love to see healing between the Roman and Protestant churches, you must understand that traditional Roman catholics get agitated whenever they hear of someone praising the Pope for making pro-protestant statements that are not 'ex cathedra'. Orthodox Jews feel the same whenever they hear of Christians doing significant life-changing work and charity among the non-believing Jews, becoming suspicious and getting very aggressive, jealous and hateful. It's understandable, I personally don't like it when a person of authority that I respect in the Protestant churches tries to be ecumenical in a way that goes against scripture in a serious manner. It's happening alot these days. So if it's not what they're supposed to be teaching, then we can't praise them for being a Catechism/Ex Cathedra catholic, but if we believe what we teach is in fact scriptural and true, we can at least praise them for being a BIBLICAL catholic, and yes, I understand how painful and infuriating it is to say this before our Roman or Orthodox friends.
     
  9. SirPalomides

    SirPalomides Active Member

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    Trent and Luther were both disasters in their own ways.
     
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  10. anglican74

    anglican74 Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Well the Eastern Churches are not immune from this, the 2nd Council of Nicea was a disaster too.. the orthodox were suppressed. I'm so glad the Western Church was not present to sign it, and was opposed it...

    The Church has taken many winding roads through the Millenia.
     
  11. Aidan

    Aidan Well-Known Member

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    Further controversy courtesy of the Vatican post office. An Easter stamp has been issued depicting a muscular Christ with 'six pack' and adorned in shreds of fabric. It may almost be 'homo erotic'. Come to think of it , that may well please some within the Vatican!
     
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  12. Anglican04

    Anglican04 Active Member Anglican

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    Yeah, I saw that on a Catholic forum. It's pretty sick for them to be sexualizing anything at the Vatican, now when they sexualize our Lord, that is a line that has been crossed. Lord have mercy on us.
     
  13. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]
    Whilst I take the point that was made in the OP, I would also recognise that the stamp commemorates not simply 500 years since the reformation but also a significant shift and more open approach of the Roman Church to other Christian traditions. It is not that long ago such a stamp would have had Luther leading them to the gates of Hades.


    [​IMG]

    I take it that this is the second stamp in question and maybe we are a bit robust in Australia, however it seems to me that it takes both incarnation and resurrection seriously, and to my mind the suggestion that it sexualises Our Lord is a bot of a stretch. My one question would be that he seems more European than Middle Eastern, however that is of little consequence.
     
  14. Aidan

    Aidan Well-Known Member

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    Philip this is not a fitting tribute to Our Blessed Lord and Saviour. It more resembles some type of athlete or "entertainer". The above image definitely would not help in turning one's mind to prayer. As for the former stamp it's totally inappropriate to replace Our Lords blessed mother and the disciple He loved with the two reformers.
     
  15. Stalwart

    Stalwart Well-Known Member Anglican

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    With all due respect, the Roman church is known for depicting our Lord in all kinds of ways, with six-packs and muscles. They have depicted God the Father, the omnipotent Being that runs the Universe, as a gray elder.

    Most egregiously of all, the Roman church has frequently depicted John the Baptist as a feminine man, a highly offensive homosexual innuendo. You can see the feminine St. John even in Leonardo DaVinci's famous The Last Supper, where he is so effeminate that conspiracies fly that DaVinci was trying to paint a woman! With the implication that perhaps St. John was gay, and had a relationship with our Lord. You have 600-700 years of misdemeanors in the regard.

    There he is, "St. John", at the left hand of our Lord:
    the_last_supper_restored_da_vinci.jpg
     
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  16. JoeLaughon

    JoeLaughon Active Member Anglican

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    In fairness The Last Supper was simply commissioned by the Sforza family and not the Roman church writ large. Also at the time the style was not considered especially masculine as delicate features and long hair was not considered uniquely feminine.
     
  17. Stalwart

    Stalwart Well-Known Member Anglican

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    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_the_Apostle#In_art

    In Medieval works of painting, sculpture and literature, Saint John is often presented in an androgynous or femininized manner.[66] Historians have related such portrayals to the circumstances of the believers for whom they were intended.[67] For instance, John's feminine features are argued to have helped to make him more relatable to women.[68] Likewise, Sarah McNamer argues that because of his status as an androgynous saint, John could function as an 'image of a third or mixed gender'[69] and 'a crucial figure with whom to identify'[70] for male believers who sought to cultivate an attitude of affective piety, a highly emotional style of devotion that, in late-medieval culture, was thought to be poorly compatible with masculinity.[71] After the Middle Ages, feminizing portrayals of Saint John continued to be made; a case in point is an etching by Jacques Bellange, shown to the right, described by art critic Richard Dorment as depicting 'a softly androgynous creature with a corona of frizzy hair, small breasts like a teenage girl, and the round belly of a mature woman.'[72]

    "St. John the Apostle by Jacques Bellange, c. 1600"

    440px-St_John_the_Apostle_by_Jacques_Bellange.jpg
     
  18. Anglican04

    Anglican04 Active Member Anglican

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    Well that is interesting.
     
  19. Aidan

    Aidan Well-Known Member

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    This image is also inappropriate of the artist
     

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