Some Thoughts after Visiting Ecuador

Discussion in 'Liturgy, and Book of Common Prayer' started by Shane R, Feb 15, 2020.

  1. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    I spent February 5-12 in Ecuador. I was traveling with Archbishop Gordon. Every place we visited had only 2 or 3 prayer books in the whole building. We did an ordination service on Saturday the 8th and 4 BCPs were really needed; one of the nuns gave her personal copy for use to get us through the service.

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  2. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    That's pretty cool. Are you in any of those pictures, and if so, which one is you? Who is the one with the Orthodox-looking mega-beard? :cool: Which cities did you visit?

    Are they using the El Libro de Oración Común which can be seen here on Amazon? https://www.amazon.com/El-Libro-Oracion-Comun-Blue/dp/0898692202/ref=sr_1_1?keywords=El+Libro+de+Oración+Común.&qid=1581895535&sr=8-1
    I wonder if there's a good way for some of these to be donated. I don't suppose Prime free shipping applies to gifts sent internationally, so shipping might cost more than the books (sending case quantities might be the most cost-effective way, or else cash donations if a more local source is available to them).

    I have begun arrangements to participate in a mission trip to Machala, Ecuador in June (no Anglican churches there, unfortunately, that I'm aware of). We will participate in daily street ministry with a clown (to attract attention) and a brief drama depicting Christ the healer and redeemer who died and rose, and help with nightly evangelism crusades where the Gospel can be conveyed in somewhat greater depth. Local churches will receive attendee information so they can do all-important follow-up.
     
  3. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    I am in each of the pictures. In the first pic, I am sandwiched between Abp. Gordon (the Santa Claus looking bearded individual) and Bp. Rosendo of Colombia. In the other two, I am out on the wing wearing a silver and red cope. The Ecuadorian Bp. is coming to the States in April to attend our General Convention. We are going to send him home with a case of prayer books and some extra vestments and altar items.

    Not having prayer books means most of the laity have memorized the responses during the service. It also means Morning and Evening prayer are unknown, even among the clergy. Rather, the common devotions are either extemporaneous or some form of Rosary.

    We were in Quito, Sangolqui, Hamaguana, and Ambato and some of its suburbs. They've invited us back in one year when they will be meeting in Banos for their annual synod. They took us out to Banos one day while we were there (it is famous for a natural mineral hot spring that comes from the volcano). The particular church we work with is called Iglesia Anglicana Universal. APA also has a mission diocese in Ecuador that works among the indigenous tribes. Segregation is still common there.

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  4. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    The visit represented the formation of a Latin American bishops conference within the Orthodox Anglican Communion. We recognized and affiliated with national churches in Ecuador, Colombia and Peru. There were already affiliated churches in Honduras, Mexico and Puerto Rico. The conference will have it's first bishops' meeting in September in Bogota.

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  5. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    That's interesting, and good to know. I see you at the radio mic; do you speak Spanish? I recently was shown the Duolingo app and downloaded it, and for me it has changed foreign language learning from a chore to a fairly fun endeavor.
     
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  6. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    I do speak some Spanish. It's a work in progress. There's a funny story to that. We were actually on several radio stations down there. The first one we did, I spit out about two lines in Spanish. The next time they went to me, they told me I could just say what I was going to say in English!

    I speak it well enough that they left me as the only translator one afternoon while we were in Sangolqui. My wife was Puerto Rican, actually from the island, and a native speaker. I have been cursed with two poor Spanish teachers in my academic life. I am mostly self taught. I had written a sermon in Spanish for the baptism service we did. I can read it well enough. But they subbed in one of the Colombians for that service. Then, Saturday evening, they dropped on me that I could preach twice on Sunday. I wrote a sermon in English using the Septuagesima readings from the 1662 and preached through our interpreter. My Spanish is not currently good enough to work up a spot sermon.
     
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  7. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    A notorious character named Archbishop Leonardo Marin of the Iglesia Anglicana Latina was working parts of Southern Ecuador. He is known for some unusual doctrines particularly surrounding UFOs. Most of the senior clergy we met knew of him and thought he was loco.

    There's also a bishop who works back and forth on the Peruvian border. I can't remember his name at the moment but he is known for funding his churches through gun running and human trafficking. You can't make this stuff up, there are some bad characters running around in purple shirts.

    I forgot to answer the question about the prayer book earlier. The Ecuadorians are using the 1979 TEC book. The Colombians and Peruvians are using a Roman Missal. It made for some difficult services since no one really knew each others texts. The 79 book is somewhat difficult to use anyway by virtue of having too many options for constructing a service. Our Ecuadorian partners were sometimes confusing themselves flipping back and forth in that book to Eucharistic prayer C and the Prayers of the People form XIV and so on. The APA has recently put the 1928 TEC book in Spanish back in print. We had taken about 4 or 5 with us and gave them away. It is an easier book to use. They are willing to use whatever we give them as long as we're doing the buying. The problem is, the APA books are $26 per copy. That adds up fast. I'm working with a printer on a project to produce an abridged book in paperback. The book will contain the Lectionary tables and Collects, Morning and Evening Prayer, the Holy Communion service, and the baptismal rite. I've been quoted a ballpark price of $6 per unit. I've still got to finish copying and formatting the lectionary tables. It's okay though because the printer is currently bogged down doing a run of Lutheran hymnals.
     
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  8. PDL

    PDL Active Member Anglican

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    Of which Anglican church are you a priest, Father?
     
  9. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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  10. PDL

    PDL Active Member Anglican

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    From photographs on the Orthodox Anglican Church's Web site I see that you wear vestments, use incense, and have tabernacles. I do not know what your beliefs are regarding the Eucharist. For example, I do not know if the Orthodox Anglican Church believes the substance of bread, wine and water change into the substance of the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Christ.

    Personally I have no problem with vestments, incense, etc. However, I note the Orthodox Anglican Church follows the Book of Common Prayer (1662) and the Thirty-nine Articles. I am wondering how the Orthodox Anglican Church reconciles the two.

    For the avoidance of doubt my question is genuine and I am truly interested in what the answer will be. Please do not see it as any form of implied criticism.
     
  11. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    We just had a clericus last fall in which one of our priests delivered a lecture about Anglican views of the eucharist. To summarize, his conclusion was that memorialism and transubstantiation are the two positions that Anglicans have not embraced (I know a fair number of clergy who believe transubstantiation as a private opinion though). General speaking OAC is in line with the larger continuing Anglican movement in practice. You will find a very few broad churchmen but most continuers tend to Laudian high churchmanship or ritualist Anglo-Catholicism (with some avowed Anglo-papalists here and there; usually old Roman priests who felt the urge to marry and have a family).

    OAC has not officially adopted this as a formulary but you would find that most Continuers subscribe to the Affirmation of St. Louis. http://www.traditionalanglicancommunion.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Affirmation-of-St.-Louis.pdf This is used as a superior authority or an interpretive key to the 39 Articles. There's a bishop named Damien Mead based out of Kent who represents the very Anglo-Catholic sort of Anglicanism that is typical in most of the Continuing movement.

    I carry a little 1662 BCP in my coat pocket when I'm out and about. I've even served the Holy Communion by that service a couple of times.
     
  12. Liturgyworks

    Liturgyworks Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Your jurisdiction and the equally Anglo Catholic ACNA are two of my favorites. I also love the very low church St. George’s Anglican in Ventura, which had been a part of the Reformed Episcopal Church.
     
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  13. JoeLaughon

    JoeLaughon Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I attend St George's! Or at least I do when I come home to Ventura. My great-grandmother was one of the original parishioners who had come over from St. Paul's Episcopal in Ventura.
     
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  14. Liturgyworks

    Liturgyworks Well-Known Member Anglican

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    The people there strike me as being very nice.
     
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