New Prayer Book

Discussion in 'Liturgy, and Book of Common Prayer' started by Jeffg, May 14, 2019.

  1. Jeffg

    Jeffg Active Member

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    I understand that the ACNA has just published a new worship book "Book of Common Prayer 2019". I just started attending an ACNA congregation occasionally. What is the differance between this new worship book and the 1928 BCP as well as the changes made in TEP 1970's BCP ?
     
  2. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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  3. Jeffg

    Jeffg Active Member

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    Whats your impression ? Better than the 1928 ? I've glanced at some of the downloads that are avaialble, but am curiouse about how/what people thingk about it. Theologicaly sound ?
     
  4. dariakus

    dariakus New Member

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    I’m still trying to figure out what about the last three of the seven commonly-recognized ecumenical councils they disagree with. The wording is very bizarre and zero clarification is given.
     
  5. Jeffg

    Jeffg Active Member

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    4. Concerning the seven Councils of the undivided Church, we affirm the teaching of the first four Councils and the Christo-logical clarifications of the fifth, sixth and seventh Councils, in so far as they are agreeable to the Holy Scriptures.

    The question is: Where do the 5th,6th and 7th Councils agree/disagree with Holy Scripture regarding Christo-logical stuff ? Any insights/Scripture quotes, etc. ???? As I do not have the material from these Councils in front of me, I cannot comment.
     
  6. Fr. Brench

    Fr. Brench Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Hey, I'm an ACNA priest and have been following the development of the 2019 BCP pretty closely since 2013. So feel free to hit me up with questions - I don't know everything of course, but I do know a few things. I keep a daily blog (link) devoted to teaching and modeling Anglican liturgy, based on the 2019 book.

    In terms of format of the book and the "order of service" 2019 and 1979 are very similar. The contemporary "novus ordo" liturgical revision is largely preserved here. This is, I understand, reflective of the fact that the majority of American Anglicans have been using the 1979 book for decades, now.

    The best way to understand the 2019 book is to see it as a revision of the 1979 book, rolled back closer to the 1928. If you look at the text of the Communion prayers, for example, the rite is much more akin to the historic Prayer Books than the 1979. If you look at the Baptism, Confirmation, Marriage, Ordination, Burial services, they look like 1979 but read more like the 1928. The Daily Office, too, is 1979-ish but with the traditional background more clearly marked out.

    If you're a die-hard 1928 (or 1662!) fan, you're not going to like this book, because it's not the 1928 (or the 1662). If you're a 1979 fan, you still might not like this book because it's got fewer choices. They made this book with a massive amount of province-wide collaboration and feedback, and with an eye to make this book as usable to as many people as possible, regardless of churchmanship or party or disposition. There's no pleasing everyone, obviously, but they did the best they could under the circumstances.

    That also explains the seven councils reference issue... high church folks love their seven councils, low church folks love their four. The language of compromise (specifically upholding Christological dogma) keeps us on the same page and increases our capacity for continued (or renewed) common prayer under one book.

    I think the 2019 book is theologically sound. It could be better in terms of liturgical traditionalism and clarity, but the more precise one gets, the more partisan one gets. It's not perfect, and I have my own list of ways it could be improved, but I'm happy enough with it.

    (btw, it's not in print yet... couple more months still)
     
  7. Jeffg

    Jeffg Active Member

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    Thank yoiu Fr. Brench for you response, very enlightening !!! Can't wait to see the finished product when it come out (June ??) . Haveing been brought up "half Epsicopalian" (other half Lutheran...thus I am "Lutherpalian") and a lover of the liturgy, I have been kind of waiting for an updated BCP from the Continuing Church Anglican Tradition. I've always kind of wondered what took so long for one of the Continuing Churchs to come up with a newer BCP , since a lot seem to have separated over the 1979 BCP, and the stuff promolgated in from the 1976/77 TEC Convention, which seems to have caused so many splits.
     
  8. Peteprint

    Peteprint Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Hi, Jeff. Actually, to my knowledge, none of the "Continuing" churches have come out with a new BCP. Most use the 1928 American version that was in use prior to the 1979. Normally the ACNA is not referred to as a continuing church, but instead, is part of the Anglican realignment movement. None of the continuing bodies ordain women, something which the ACNA does. I am looking forward to seeing the printed ACNA BCP as well; I have been very impressed by the examples on the ACNA website.
     
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  9. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    The closest the Continuing churches have ever come to a prayer book revision is the modest grammatical changes made by Peter Toon many years ago. For the most part, the movement is reactionary and revising anything is a non-starter.
     
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  10. Jeffg

    Jeffg Active Member

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    Interesting... I wonder if the Continuing Churchs will ever think about a new book. The BCP in use is almost 100 years old now.
     
  11. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    The thought is rolling around. Bp. Hewitt, in his book The Dayspring From on High, supported prayer book revision. His idea was to make a modest grammatical edit of the American Missal - much like Peter Toon's liturgies but based on the Missal rather than the BCP. I suppose the biggest fear is that any form of revision would lead to multiple rites. Then there are those who think the archaic English is superior for prayer.
     
  12. Jeffg

    Jeffg Active Member

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    They could always just use the new ACNA one. LOL !!!!
     
  13. Peteprint

    Peteprint Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I really dislike the archaic English (e.g., hath holpen his servant Israel ). When I use my 1928, I find myself changing some of the words that I speak out loud into more contemporary English without even thinking about it.

    But I do know some who insist on the Elizabethan, just like those I knew in my Orthodox days who insisted that Old Slavonic and Koine Greek were somehow sacred languages. I suppose others feel the same about Latin in the Catholic Church. Muslims insist that the true Quran is only in Arabic, and Hindus swear by Sanskrit.

    I feel that any liturgical language should be understandable to the average educated person in a given society.
     
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  14. Liturgyworks

    Liturgyworks Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I personally prefer the traditional language, however, as far as contemporary language liturgical texts go, the 2019 BCP is stylistically one of the three most elegant (the other two are an obscure Orthodox prayer book, and a service book used in one of the Orthodox churches). A major win for me was the 2019 BCP using “and with your spirit” instead of the incorrect ICEL phrase “and also with you,” which obviously is not what the Latin “et cum spiritu tuo” from which the BCP and most Western liturgies are derived means.*

    *Actually this phrase appears in all of the liturgical rites of Christendom: West Syriac, East Syriac, old Byzantine, Old Russian, post-Nikonian Russian, Coptic, Ethiopian, Armenian, Mozarabic, Ambrosian, and all Orthodox service books render it as “and with [thy/your] spirit”; I believe the proliferation of “and also with you” in contemporary service books is entirely due to the influence of ICEL and the original translation Novus Ordo missal in the RCC. It still baffles me that the LCMS, which is rather traditional, used it in their very traditional Lutheran Service Book of 2006.
     
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  15. Peteprint

    Peteprint Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I like what I have seen in the 2019 as well (regarding more contemporary language).
     
  16. Liturgyworks

    Liturgyworks Well-Known Member Anglican

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    As contemporary language goes, its as good a work as I have seen, so I see it filling that niche well. I also liked the simplification vs. the 1979 BCP, which is extremely complex.

    Although personally, I would prefer to go to a parish, if one exists anywhere, that was using the traditional language / traditional theology rectification of the 1979 BCP, the 1994 Anglican Service Book.

    By the way, would anyone happen to know if the ACNA plans on following in the footsteps of the Episcopal Church and releasing the book into the public domain? I really really hope they do that. For that matter, if they decide to publish a collectible, commemorative Folio-sized Standard Edition, like the Standard Editions of the 1892 and 1928 BCPs, I would want to buy that (one was planned for the 1979 BCP but alas, not printed, but you can see what it might have looked like from the Prospectus provided by the publisher, here: http://justus.anglican.org/resources/bcp/Standard1979.htm ).

    The 1928 Updike Standard Edition of the American BCP is one of my two favorite liturgical productions from a typographic perspective, the other being the Series 2 Trial Eucharist from the Church of England, printed in the mid 1960s (which featured a serif font and traditional language, but the rubrics were printed in Univers bold, in a blue color, which beautifully corresponded with the eggshell blue cover). Alas the Orthodox Church has only managed one typographically interesting service book in English that I have, that being the sluzhbenik (the liturgikon, or book of the divine liturgies of the Eucharist) published by New Skete monastery.
     
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  17. Peteprint

    Peteprint Well-Known Member Anglican

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    My favorite copy of the 1928 BCP is this one; hardcover, gilt-edged pages, two ribbons, and fairly large type. Size is 5.25 x 7.75
     

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  18. Liturgyworks

    Liturgyworks Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Very nice. I need to get one of those, and also a 1962 Canadian book (another of my favorite editions).
     
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  19. Peteprint

    Peteprint Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I have the Canadian 1962, English deposited 1928, AMiA An Anglican Prayerbook, 1662 English, 1979 US, and the Scottish 1929 in my collection. Also reprints of the 1549 and 1559. I also have a REC BCP somewhere and I plan on purchasing the ACNA 2019 as soon as it is available. :)
     
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  20. Peteprint

    Peteprint Well-Known Member Anglican

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