Christian responses to US Politics

Discussion in 'The Commons' started by Tiffy, Mar 26, 2020.

  1. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    That is a misreading of the article and of the survey results. Here, I'll help you spot the sentence most pertinent to the headline:
    "Other findings include the fact that only a third (31 percent) of the Biden voters said they are active in a local church congregation." (It appears that they don't even attend church services.)
    Hence the article's conclusion that 59% (more than half, not quite "two-thirds," but "most") don't practice their religion. However, Barna is not the one who came up with the headline or the article, so the statement, "according to George Barna, disciples of Jesus Christ must... (blah blah blah)" is a distortion and an inaccurate attribution.

    Really, it escapes me why anyone would wish to belittle someone who conducts a survey (Barna) and tells the results thereof. Or with a journalist who writes up a news story about the survey, either. Perhaps the newspaper editor who picked a headline to fit available space could have been more precise with his wording, but is it worth a rant? O_o
     
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  2. Tiffy

    Tiffy Well-Known Member

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    Maybe that conclusion is an oversimplification. You wouldn't regularly attend a Roman Catholic church, and Roman Catholics wouldn't regularly attend Protestant churches, presumably because both categories of 'believer' take their religion 'seriously'. Atheists (far from being politically inactive or morally corrupt) would probably attend neither. Perhaps there is another category of non church attendees who 'seriously' consider neither 'Roman Catholic' churches nor Evangelical 'born again' Protestant churches to be comprised of 'serious' believers, yet in many other ways are Disciples of Christ in their 'beliefs' and way of life. Pinning down discipleship to mere frequency of church attendance would be equivalent to equating political fanaticism with party membership, rather than personal convictions.

    The research is all very well, it is the conclusions which seem to be influenced by political bias, trying to paint Trump's opposition as being morally corrupt in order to make Trump and Trump's supporters look morally superior. We all know in here though that that is an oversimplification when it comes to an assessment of human morality and 'righteousness' for all have sinned and there is no one righteous, no not one. Regardless of literalist Bible belief or assiduous church attendance.

    Who was it that said "Lies, damn lies, and statistics, in that order". Henry Ford, I think. I may be wrong about that but I think also he wasn't righteously right about much besides making cars and making money.
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  3. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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    Mark Twain, or perhaps not.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lies,_damned_lies,_and_statistics
     
  4. Tiffy

    Tiffy Well-Known Member

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  5. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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    USCaseLoad.jpg

    Congratulation to the US for turning around the growth in cases in the war against Covid19. This data till the 17th February shows a decline in new cases from a peak of 300,000 to around 70,000, more that 75% drop.
     
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  6. Tiffy

    Tiffy Well-Known Member

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  7. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    Tiffy, if you'll post something about Eastern Orthodoxy it might liven up this thread immensely. You could have 5 more pages of posts in 2 days! :laugh:
     
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  8. Tiffy

    Tiffy Well-Known Member

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    I have just read through the thread. I wondered what everyone had been up to, and where they'd gone for the last three days. Now I know, only to discover I can't put my 5 eggs into that particular 'basket' until sometime next week. :laugh: I'm peeved.

    Still I managed to get a Pentecost Sunday homily written. Hoping I don't cause any of our congregation offense or lull anyone into the arms of Morphius.
    .
     
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  9. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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    However it does give you a week to construct a dazzling response to the thread that will be both cogent and apposite, not to mention of course entirely orthodox and Anglican to its bootstraps. I look forward to reading you next post on the subject.
     
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  10. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    What?? You're looking to Tiffy to write something "entirely orthodox and Anglican to its bootstraps"?? Why, Botolph, you do believe in miracles!! :biglaugh:
     
  11. Tiffy

    Tiffy Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps he's thinking that a Reader in the good old C of E who grew up in a church dedicated by Bishop Andrewes himself in 1620, the first C of E church dedicated 'Anglican', whose service of dedication was cribbed by Cranmer and published in the 1663 edition of the BCP is just a little more likely to come up with something orthodoxly 'Anglican' than a whitewall-tyred, rebel, American 'Retread'. :clap::p ;)
    .
     
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  12. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    It's good to have a positive mental image of oneself. ;) Do you recall introducing yourself to me, a couple of years ago, as the "resident Anglican heretic"? :) Hard to forget that!

    Me, I'm more of a raised-black-letter-sidewall man. But I will admit that I'm pumped up about Jesus! :yes:
     
  13. Tiffy

    Tiffy Well-Known Member

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    Only good friends can rib one another and remain friends. Jesus called us his friends so friendly leg pulling is OK by me. :) Being filled with the Spirit is pheumatic indeed. I never get tyred of talking about Jesus to people.
    .
     
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  14. Tiffy

    Tiffy Well-Known Member

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  15. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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    I am currently reading a book that examines the relationship between Trump and Putin, and in short it is both enlightening and disturbing. In concerns me how much our western democracies may well be influenced by the rich and the powerful (oligarchs if you like) who are inclined to use that influence with kleptpcratic tendencies. A recent review in Australia showed that our 100 richest people doubled their wealth in the first two years of the pandemic, while the elderly and in firm died in great numbers, and the rest of us got distinctly less solvent.

    For good or ill, I suspect when we speak of Trump, we speak of the last and next President of the USA.
     
  16. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    Not true. US conservatives are being encouraged to not hate Putin or the Russian people, and to view with some skepticism the MSM's crusade against Putin.

    We in the US should not let ourselves get so whipped up with outrage and "righteous indignation" that we support entry of the US military into outright war with Russia, should we?

    Pres. L.B. Johnson, we now know, lied to the American people about North Vietnam allegedly shooting at US ships in the Gulf of Tonkin; he did this in order to whip up support for a stupid war against N. Vietnam.

    Pres. F.D. Roosevelt instituted a series of ever-more-restrictive embargoes and trade hindrances against Japan beginning in 1938. The 1911 US-Japan trade treaty was terminated in 1939. In 1940 he got Congress to pass (and he signed into law) the Export Control Act which reduced Japan's access to raw materials (for example, they were getting 90% of their copper from the US). This was followed by the seizure of all Japanese assets within the US on July 26, 1941 (similar to what we've done to Russian assets btw). At some point he closed the Panama Canal to Japanese traffic. Then (8/1/41) FDR placed an oil embargo on Japan. Furthermore, FDR was talking to his top military brass about the feasibility of sailing the Pacific fleet in a string all across the strategic points to block Japan's shipping. Japan was by this time being starved of fuel and raw materials and their only realistic means of supply was to expand their war to seize southeast Asia, and they couldn't allow further interference in the Pacific, so they struck Pearl Harbor. This provided the necessary public outcry and eager enlistments needed to declare and wage war against Japan. And in the Atlantic, FDR caused arms and ammo to be shipped on a passenger ship, the Lusitania, for the fight against Germany; Germany paid for large newspaper ads warning civilians to not sail on that ship because they knew the situation and were going to try to sink it, which they did. Once again, the public outrage over the "murder" of innocent civilians on a passenger ship by Germany was the lever needed for FDR to get Congress to declare war against Germany.

    I could say some similar things about the way the US populace was goaded into entering WWI, and the war in Iraq, and the war in Afghanistan. But I think you get the picture.

    Really, ALL of the US residents should be warned in the same manner as the link you provided. But the liberals and progressives only listen to MSM, and MSM isn't warning anybody. MSM is busy running stories about how awful, horrible, and monstrous Putin is, and how we need to boycott everything Russian (which is causing the cancellation of ballets and piano concerts, dumping of vodka, and a host of similar stuff). It is not a healthy time to be of Russian descent and living in the US. Things could get out of control mighty quickly.

    It's a hate campaign, and Christians should not be involved in hating people for any reason, let alone for being Russian.
     
  17. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    I'll tell you this: if Trump had been reelected, you can be sure Russia would not have invaded Ukraine. But with Biden's ineptitude, here we are.

    I would prefer not seeing Trump in the White House again, however he was and would be far preferable to the current senile puppet.
     
  18. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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  19. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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    An IF:THEN analysis of history, even recent history is difficult and can only be best guess. Putin does seem a little 'loose canon' and I suspect he would recognise that quaity in Trump, which would give him some fear or at least something to think about. Trump also had an ambivalent relationship with Ukrainian, so it is not so clear what the outcome would have been. However Trump and Putin were on speaking terms, so there may hve been some consultation.

    A year in office does seem to have weighed heavily on Biden, and possibly aged him another 10 years. Like many in the world I would prefer the good people of the USA to find a younger leader next time.
     
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  20. Invictus

    Invictus Well-Known Member

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    You’re telling me the guy who completely rolled over for Russia at every available opportunity, and railed against NATO just as often, would have suddenly and simultaneously discovered a backbone and multilateralism and “done something” to prevent Russia from invading one of its neighbors? Honestly, how could anyone believe something so asinine? Trump was manifestly unfit for office going all the way back to before the primaries, and was an absolute disgrace to the office in every sense of the word. To assert otherwise is to deny the testimony of one’s own eyes and ears. And what, exactly, was Biden - who is not “senile” - supposed to do about it, send American troops to Ukraine and risk a nuclear exchange (because that’s the only thing he hasn’t done at this point)? And for what? Ukraine isn’t a vital U.S. interest to begin with. If anything, our response was too strong. The sanctions we’re attempting to impose aren’t going to be sustainable and everyone knows it.