Married a Baptist

Discussion in 'Family, Relationships, and Single Life' started by Jay-Rod, Aug 27, 2019.

  1. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    My wife and I were married 10 years ago. We met at church. It is a Baptist Church. Her dad is the pastor. I was Reformed at the time, but over many years found my way into Anglicanism. I have attended an Anglican Parish on Saturday nights sporadically, and even sometimes on Sunday mornings. However, going to two churches is difficult and it creates some division in the family. Because of that, I have decided to solely attend the family's Baptist church.

    However, I do have a question. We are trying for a child. I think it would be very difficult to deny Baptism to this child, but the Baptist church obviously won't baptize until a public profession can be articulated.

    The Anglican church I've attended will baptize the baby. My wife is supportive of baptizing the baby. I can't imagine explaining salvation from a Baptist point of view to my child (fire brimstone for you, but say the prayer and you get in the heaven line and have "eternal security" because you said the prayer...but you better make sure you really meant it)

    Should we just baptize the baby at the Anglican Church, teach that theology at home, but to maintain unity with the family continue to attend the Baptist church? Or some other idea?
     
  2. JoeLaughon

    JoeLaughon Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I would strongly encourage you to get your child baptized regardless of what you choose to do.

    At the same time, I think you should strive to maintain unity while discussing these issues with your wife. Is there any particular issues with Anglicanism that they have issue with?
     
  3. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    Pretty much all of it, except for that sliver where fundamentalist Baptist and CS Lewis type Anglican agree...like the Trinity.
     
  4. Magistos

    Magistos Active Member Anglican

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    Well....I've been giving this thought. I grew up SBC (not IFB), and my family has definitely been moderate (by Baptist standards), and I have never been Reformed. Married a Latin-Rite Catholic (now Byzantine Rite). We manage to go to two churches and be active members of both with 3 kids. My parents did not object to my children being baptized as infants. All that said to say I have a feeling of empathy for you.

    It is NOT easy, and obviously we do not have the issue of her dad being pastor. I really don't have an answer for that, especially as it sounds like the father is very much against your beliefs at this point.

    I think, if you and your wife are in agreement, that you should baptize the baby, and teach the theology at home. As a Baptist, the father shouldn't really have an argument because he doesn't believe it will have any efficacy anyway. That said, it would kick the can down the road when he wants to baptize his grandchild...who has already been baptized. That makes for a very difficult conversation with a child. I'm not sure I have a real answer for you, beyond that word and that caution.
     
  5. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    The family being in ministry here in the same town is definitely the kicker. If that wasn’t the situation I really wouldn’t care what they thought.
     
  6. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    In some ways I feel I just need to put all my Anglican beliefs on hold until her dad retires. Just go with the flow, stop being a cog in the wheel.
    Seems like the only simple solution...though I fear it could lead to a spiritual desert.
     
  7. bwallac2335

    bwallac2335 Well-Known Member

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    Don't put your beliefs on hold. Stand up to her dad. It is your child.
     
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  8. anglican74

    anglican74 Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I agree... It is your child, you are the father, and the head of the household

    There is a good neutral ground where you and your son's grandpa can meet; say you get the child baptized (since you're 'the father' and he cannot deny that), and even involve your child in regular liturgical prayers, say on mornings and evenings; but then you meet the grandpa on the neutral ground of studying the Scriptures (he'd love that); say you have a regular bible study with your son where you involve your father in law, get the three of you to hold regular meetings over dinner (men's night out), so that your father in law doesn't feel excluded, and even gets to put his 2 cents in, I'm sure he will be mollified
     
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  9. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    Really, my father in law is actually very gracious about it. There is never any open hostility about this stuff. It’s just my beliefs and absence from church sticks out like a sore thumb. But what’s an even bigger deal is how involved my wife has always been in the church. She just thrives there and is involved in everything. Leaving a church is leaving a family. Getting involved in a new church takes time. She likes Anglican beliefs but I know she doesn’t quite see what the big deal is, what the actual differences are. She’s much more of a practical person, not deeply theological.
     
  10. Anglo-cracker

    Anglo-cracker Member Anglican

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    I can truly sympathize with you, Jay rod. I am in a rather similar situation, I can tell you this, because I am about 10 years further down the road, that if you introduce the Anglican way to your child now, it will be much easier. My five children have been raised SBC and their reaction to my Anglicanism runs from amusement to mild hostility. Like you, I am more less locked in at our Baptist church, which is a very good church in its own right, and it is a family to me, and my kids have been nurtured there. My two adult sons are both youth pastors, one Evangelical and the other Presbyterian.
    I would advise you to go ahead and have your child baptized. As to where you attend church, do it united as a family. That will have a greater effect on your kid's formation.
    I wish I had found Anglicanism 20 years ago.
     
  11. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    Thank you for that perspective. I've thought about that. With things like liturgy and sacraments, its does seem like the earlier the better for kids. Otherwise the reaction you've seen is probably what is to be expected.

    I can baptize the baby and obviously teach at home, but what age do you think is important for actual participation in the worship?

    Confirmation and first communion classes seem to be around age 10 or 12 here. The younger children leave the main service after about 10 minutes from the start of liturgy. I think they do teach them basics in the children's service though. Probably some sort of basic liturgy. I'd be shocked if the children's service and teachings are the same at this Anglican church as they are at the Baptist church.
     
  12. JoeLaughon

    JoeLaughon Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Do your in-laws have a list of, say, their top 5 objections? If it "doesn't matter" then why not attend an Anglican church?

    Could not a double attendance solve this problem in the meantime? You could take the sacraments at a night service or during the week while attending with your wife's family on Sunday. You are equally a part of your wife's family as her parents. Your opinion on these matters just as much. If they are going to insist that you attend a baptist congregation "as a family" then you have a right to insist on participation in an Anglican Church.
     
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  13. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    We were doing the double attendance for a while. Work on Saturdays was making that difficult and the church is about 40 min away so it was just too much for now.

    Its hard to explain. They don't have like vocal objections, though if you were to get in a direct conversation about it then yes, most everything Anglicans do and believe would be objected to, so its just an underlying tension. To marry a pastors daughter of a very tight knit family and church to then go and take her and their grandkids into an completely foreign tradition will do that I guess. What would be very odd to me is if they were very supportive of it. I know pastor families who would dis own me for this, so all in all, I'm fortunate.
     
  14. Anglo-cracker

    Anglo-cracker Member Anglican

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    Again I would suggest the younger the better, maybe depending on the child. If you decide to remain at your Baptist church, make it a point to visit the Anglican parish for holidays. We always go Christmas Eve and Easter.
    Oh no! That makes me CEO!
    I have been introducing Evening Prayer at home through the Calender, on a major saints day we have ice cream after prayer (bribery) Why not? Its a feast day!
    As a matter of fact, my Reformed son is angling to have it today for St Augustine.
    We also observe Advent and I encourage them to participate in Lent.
     
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  15. JoeLaughon

    JoeLaughon Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I feel you. While not quite the same, I married into a very low-church, evangelical "non-denom" family which was (and occasionally is) the source of some tension.
     
  16. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    I like those idea, Anglo. That makes a lot of sense.
     
  17. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    So this is awkward, but I posted pretty much the same question on a Reformed forum. I grew up nominally reformed and I respect their intellectual rigor, so I was curious what their opinion would be on the matter. I also figured they’d have higher traffic and give a quicker response. Whether one is Anglican or Reformed, the paedo s credo baptism problem is similar.

    To sign up for the forum you have to be reformed, so I just filled it in like a reformed guy would so I could ask my question. I got a lot of responses, which I really appreciated.

    Surprisingly one of them came here and saw this post and “called me out”. It was a little awkward and in hindsight i guess it looked more deceptive than anything I would have intended.

    So in response I said...
    I value the reformed perspective. Wasn’t trying to be totally dishonest. I just didn’t think I would be able to ask or that you would answer my question if I asked from an Anglican perspective. You can’t join the forum to ask anything without being reformed. It was still a legit question. I just wanted to cut straight to the issue of Baptism and not debate people as to why i wasn’t Presbyterian. No malice was intended. I will say that it was very interesting seeing the similarities and differences in response between the two perspectives. All appreciated. The prayers are appreciated too. We ALL need prayer, BL, even those who have it all figured out.
    For using you guys as a means to an end, not interacting with you completely honestly as brothers, I repent.
    When I say no malice was intended, I just mean the core of the question wasn't dishonest and I wasn't trying to waste your time or start a futile debate.

    Here’s a summary of their responses...

    God's providence would have it I just stumbled on the below thread you started over at Anglican Forums...you've been dishonest and have misled brothers and sisters...obviously see you are a confused and conflicted man...I'll commit to praying for you friend. You are in need of it.


    If your conscience will allow u to haphazardly lie to brethren, without any repentance, this would be a wake-up call to myself.

    this person, lied and deceived to get past the membership rules to join the board. Having been exposed, perhaps thinking to correct this after the fact, he 'wiped' his profile of all the info necessary to meet membership requirements. (I did that because I was trying to make certain aspects of my profile more accurate, but also deleted things because i was scarred they’d try to docs me. I don’t want people in my circle know I’ve wrestled with this.)...this is one of the more egregious examples of deception to come our way in a while... Pray that Ryan (or this person if that is not his name) is truly repentant and if as Scott observed, this light handling of the ninth commandment reflects broadly in his manner of life, lying so easily, that he contemplate this command more seriously and amend his life according.

    Me now...
    So, Is it just me or are they a bit over the top about all this? Not saying I was right. But they look at this like a malicious attack or something. Good grief, maybe make a guest part of your forum so non reformed types could ask a question?

    Is this why Calvinists have such a bad rep?
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2019
  18. JoeLaughon

    JoeLaughon Well-Known Member Anglican

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    This is the most absurd thing I've ever read in my life.

    1) If he is claiming that one cannot hold to the infant baptism position while being Reformed, then he needs to read John Calvin (or any historic confessions of the Reformed churches) who calls credobaptism basically satanic in nature.
    2) He is is claiming that you cannot be Reformed while being Anglican, that is also nonsense. Our Reformers were clearly Calvinist in nature, to the point where the Synod of Dort invited the Church of England (even Bishop George Carleton who they gave a position of honor as a holder of the episcopal office). Our formularies are broadly reformed as is our liturgy. Utter absurdity.

    Sadly you've run into a very nasty corner of the Online Reformed world that is obsessed with accusing people of breaking various of the ten commandments. I would simply brush off this ridiculous accusation.
     
  19. Jay-Rod

    Jay-Rod New Member

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    Oh sorry, maybe I didn’t make my post right. They are upset that I posed as a Presbyterian to get my question answered, not that reformed don’t baptize babies.
     
  20. Anglo-cracker

    Anglo-cracker Member Anglican

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    Consider it a lesson in humility, I guess. One with less humility might have asked the accuser what he was doing on the Anglican forum? I wonder if it was my Presbyterian son, that'd be a hoot!
    JoeLaughon is right though, that one can be Anglican and Reformed (J I Packer for one) so you didn't need to lie to join their esteemed forum.