Babies, children, and demographic death spirals

Discussion in 'Questions?' started by amazinglove, Jun 20, 2019.

  1. amazinglove

    amazinglove New Member

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    So, I am new to Episcopal/Anglican worship, but I love it. I have been visiting different parishes in my area (and even a little bit distant) to see how different people do church and to figure out which parish is for me. I realize it is important to put down some roots and build community. What bothers me, is that I see parish after parish of no children. These parishes are in a demographic death spiral. Once I noticed it, I cannot unsee it. It's depressing. I recently was talking with a longtime member who mentioned as an aside how many funerals they had recently. Without the endowment, they would have had to sell the building years ago. I don't want to go around asking upsetting questions of people at parishes that I'm not even a member of, but are the existing members arranging things at church the way they like it without regard for what a visting family with children would need to feel at home? The term "reverent worship" is mentioned on these parishes websites, and I like that, but I would be okay hearing children making noise from time to time to know that the parish has a future. I would also be okay with there being something in the service for children to do, something that involved them especially. Knowing what Christ said about children, his attitude toward them, revence toward him should include children and their needs being just as central as adults. There is a local RC parish that has a cry room. I looked online and I see that those are controversial. Is it enough for a parish to have someone designated as being responsible for providing "child care" during the service if by chance someone with children ever shows up someday? I guess that is a start, but only a start. I am tempted to keep visiting parishes until I find one with children and join there no matter how far away from home it is because I cannot unsee this depressing and suicidal (i.e. parishes killing themselves) syndrome now that I have noticed it. It seems that if existing parish members really care about their parish, they will put what families with children want before what they personally want so that their parish will have a future.
     
  2. amazinglove

    amazinglove New Member

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    (More thoughts, I'm replying to my own post rather than edit.)
    These are some quotes from the current Bishop of Rome:

    “…children cry, they are noisy, they don’t stop moving. But it really irritates me when I see a child crying in church and someone says they must go out. God’s voice is in a child’s tears: they must never be kicked out of church.”

    “Today the choir will sing but the most beautiful choir of all is the choir of the infants who will make a noise. Some will cry because they are not comfortable or because they are hungry. If they are hungry, mothers, feed them, without thinking twice. Because they are the most important people here.“
     
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  3. amazinglove

    amazinglove New Member

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    How about partnering with the local crisis pregnancy center? Helping save babies, welcoming them and their moms into the Church, wow what an opportunity to help. Do we want these moms and their babies, who often feel too embarassed to return to the church they grew up in, or did not go to church at all growing up, to come into our parishes and worship with us? Do we want them? I hope so, but I fear the answer is that many already in the pews would not want them. Would we be willing to purchase a van to pick them up on Sunday mornings? Hopefully eventually a bus?
     
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  4. bwallac2335

    bwallac2335 Well-Known Member

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    Children are a blessing are a blessing are a blessing. One of my greatest sadness is only having one child. I would have like 3-5 if not more. My wife told me over the phone three years ago that she was divorcing me and would not work on the marriage. This was only 3 months are our first child was born. So we divorced and I have not even dated since then and since I don't know the truth about divorce and remarriage I choose to be safe. AT my current church the women my age have a fertility rate of about 2 of the regular young adult women goers.
     
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  5. Botolph

    Botolph Well-Known Member

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    The reasons for the the change in the dimensions of the average Anglican demographic are complex, and in truth I suspect we have not known what to do about it and in reality still do not know what to do about it.
    • There are a lot more opportunities in society today for social interaction
    • Society no longer sees Sunday as a day set apart and many things now happen on Sunday
    • A much greater sense of people being entitled to organise things to suit themselves
    • The message of the Gospel being presented so as to require little
    • Many times the big issues for the Church are internal matters
    • A failure to speak the prophetic word
    The response of some has been to embrace a mega-church methodology with bands, music, production lighting, and a range of tools in line with the contemporary idiom, and someone to rap the Gospel. For a fairly trad Anglican this seems a little divorced from Church as I know it, and seems to have more of an entertainment feel and genre. May be part of the issue is that there is now an entertainment industry, whereas once upon a time Sunday and going to Church represented the break in the routine, there are now so many offerings that we are no longer the best pick.

    I think some of the answers are
    • To be authentic to who we are
    • To recover our deep sense of joy
    • To engage meaningfully with those outside the Church
    • To be as interested in the world as we are in the Church
    • To be less critical of other ways of doing Church
    • To reflect more deeply on the life of Christ and the life of the world that we might recover the prophetic voice.
     
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  6. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    It has been a struggle since my wife died. The younger girl was only six months old when it happened. The church members weren't quite sure what to do with my two children. There were times the organist expected me to not vest and participate in the liturgy because there was no one there to watch them - how is that possible when we've got about 8 grandmas in the church? There are times when I enjoy doing supply work because those congregations don't take my children for granted like our home church does.

    I've taught the older one the Sign of the Cross, the Antiphon for Compline, and Hail Mary. We are working on the Our Father.
     
  7. Symphorian

    Symphorian Well-Known Member

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    My church has a good relationship with the village primary school (not a CofE school) and a small team from the church are engaged with the 'Open the Book' scheme run by the Bible Society. Essentially this is about taking Bible stories into primary schools.

    https://www.biblesociety.org.uk/get-involved/open-the-book/

    When the primary school children leave for secondary school, our church gifts them a nice Bible.

    We also do 'experience' days at the church with the primary school children, especially at Christmas and Easter. Recently the children painted some amazing almost life sized figures from Bible stories and decorated the walls of the church with them. It was almost like going back to pre Reformation times when the church interior would've been covered in murals.

    For a considerable time now we've provided a children's area at the back of the north aisle of the church. This has child friendly seating, toys, colouring books, crayons etc. One of our Open the Book team is happy to keep an eye on young children if needed.
     
    Last edited: Jun 20, 2019
  8. amazinglove

    amazinglove New Member

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    After making inquiries, I found a parish bursting with children, and it's not far away. It's in a nearby small town I usually don't think much about. Several years ago, they got a new priest who made children's ministry a priority. They do lots of things, which I will better understand over the coming weeks, but one thing was very interesting and simple. During the final hymn of the mass, all of the children gather in the music area and pick up maraccas and similiar instruments and accompany the pianist.
     
  9. rcconvert

    rcconvert New Member

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    This is a widespread concern. Mark Steyn wrote a book entitled, America Alone. BTW: Mark Steyn is Canadian. He paints a picture of the trajectory of Western society primarily relying on UN birth and death rate numbers, immigration patterns, various government policies, and census trends. He wrote this book in 2008, and it appears that some of his projections/predictions are accurate. In summary, the people of Western developed nations experience more death each day than birth--specifically Europeans and Caucasian folks who trace their family line back to Europe. On the other hand, every once in awhile I attend a Spanish speaking Mass. There is a nice blend of generational attendance--including young children of all ages.
     
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  10. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    I saw a friend report on his attendance at yesterday's services. He noted that he had old folks and young folks, but the 55-70 demographic was notably absent. I would neck it down it a bit more to the 45-65 crowd while acknowledging his point. These folks find a dozen reasons to be absent each Sunday, cannot articulate the orthodox Christian faith, and don't much care what their children are doing.
     
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