eastern rite anglicanism

Discussion in 'Questions?' started by mark fisher, Aug 10, 2022.

  1. mark fisher

    mark fisher Member Anglican

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    has anyone else herad of this what are your opinions
     
  2. PDL

    PDL Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I have heard of some Eastern Orthodox churches having a Western Rite. I have never heard of Eastern Rite Anglicanism.
     
  3. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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  4. ZachT

    ZachT Well-Known Member

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    I've never heard of it, seems to run contrary to the very premise of 'common prayer' that distinguishes Anglicans so meaningfully from other episcopal protestant denominations.

    I imagine if the Alexandrian Province doesn't buy into using the Alexandrian rite, despite the rich history of that tradition, then we won't see too many Anglicans in Eastern Europe/Western Asia buying into a Byzantine rite practice.
     
  5. Br. Thomas

    Br. Thomas Active Member

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  6. Br. Thomas

    Br. Thomas Active Member

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    I have come across a group that calls itself Anglican Orthodox Church - International. Their beliefs and comments are available in the "About" section of their Facebook page.https://www.facebook.com/groups/32130590007/

    It caught my attention due to its exclusion of the title "Father" for its priests and the forbidding of the veneration of saints and other issues.
     
  7. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    @Br. Thomas They are an uber-low church schism from the group founded by James Parker Dees in 1964. Some may argue, with a certain amount of validity, that they have retained the original Dees culture moreso than the Orthodox Anglican Church (the larger group with Dees' provenance). They have no real traction and only really exist in any significant quantity in the area of Mobile Bay, AL. In recent years they have accrued rather more bishops than one would think is necessary for a group with less than 10 parishes. They dabble in international mission but have no significant overseas presence either. They've tried to sue for the trademarks a few times and not been successful.

    I serve as Secretary General of the aforementioned Orthodox Anglican Communion. We are not Eastern Rite but our original primary line of Apostolic Succession was Eastern. In the case of the name, the intention was more to draw a contrast with 'heterodox' than to make an association with Eastern Christianity.
     
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  8. Matthew J Taylor

    Matthew J Taylor Member

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    The Free Church of England has a parish in Russia and it simply uses a Russian translation of our 1662-esque BCP.
    Personally I would rather a Reformed Eastern Rite was used but that's definitely not my call to make.
     
  9. Matthew J Taylor

    Matthew J Taylor Member

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    Does not the Anglican conception of "common prayer" only apply within a realm?
    There is no reason why different countries must all share the same prayer book.
     
  10. ZachT

    ZachT Well-Known Member

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    All of them are collectively descended from the 1662 BCP. We all speak a common liturgical language. If I was to travel to the states I imagine the service would be 90% familiar to me, with a few novelties unique to their province. Likewise if I was to travel to England.

    That would not be the case with an Eastern Rite practice. It would be entirely unique. Not that there's anything inferior or missing with any of the Eastern Rites, but there's something special about all Anglicans being united in common prayer.
     
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  11. PDL

    PDL Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Why? What would it look like?

    I think it is not a good idea. It's like saying the Russian Orthodox Church here in the UK should use a Western rite.

    Each church should use its own proper rites.
     
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  12. Matthew J Taylor

    Matthew J Taylor Member

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    There shouldn't be a Russian Orthodox Church beyond the borders of Russia, there should be orthodox churches of those countries, using liturgies of that country's patrimony.
    The Cathedral Church of Our Lady and Saint Ninian, the cathedral of the Diocese of the British Isles, an Old Calendarist jurisdiction, uses the Sarum Rite for Mass, knowing that Orthodoxy must not be foreign.
     
  13. PDL

    PDL Well-Known Member Anglican

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    Why?

    Why?
     
  14. Matthew J Taylor

    Matthew J Taylor Member

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    Because a French church should be French, not Russian, an Albanian church should be Albanian, not Russian, an American church should be American, not Russian.
    As for patrimony, because the churches of a nation should be in common prayer.

    Odd for a CofE person to object to the idea of nations having churches, the structure in which the English Reformation was able to occur.
     
  15. PDL

    PDL Well-Known Member Anglican

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    I do not object per se to churches being associated with nations. However, I think you can go too far in saying a church is [enter nationality]. However, I do not believe you cannot have the Russian Orthodox Church in the UK. By your reasoning the C of E church in Bruseels should be replace by a [Anglican] Church of Belgium or the C of E chapel in Monaco replaced by the [Anglican] Church of Monaco. I don't know if the former would use Dutch or French or the latter use French or Monagesque.
     
  16. Matthew J Taylor

    Matthew J Taylor Member

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    Yes I would support that.
    It may take years, if ever, for Anglican jurisdictions to be self-supporting in certain realms, but I do believe that they should be self-governing.
     
  17. PDL

    PDL Well-Known Member Anglican

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    For one church in each location. Seriously.

    So you do not accept that Russians living in say Stirling should have access to the Russian Orthodox Church? They should be made to have a westernised liturgy in English or Gaelic.

    English, who are members of the church of England, should not have access to a Church of England chapel in Berlin?
     
  18. Rexlion

    Rexlion Well-Known Member

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    There is a Russian Orthodox church not far from us (in the midwest of the USA). There are people of Russian descent living around here, and some of them attend that church. I am old-fashioned; I would never presume to tell them, "You shouldn't have a RO church outside of Russia."

    After all, this is the USA, land of the formerly free and home of the grandchildren of the brave. :rolleyes:
     
  19. Matthew J Taylor

    Matthew J Taylor Member

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    Yes, with the intention that it does not remain just one church.
    I have no objection to the liturgy being translated into Russian, that's a necessary component of my commitment to worship in the vernacular tongue.
    It seems once again prudent that a liturgy in English be used. Berlin has not only a CofE parish but also a parish of the Anglikanische Kirche in Deutschland, (http://christchurchberlin.de/) whose provincial liturgies, though a translations of the BCP, incorporates language from the historic Lutheran liturgies, and therefore makes use of the native German patrimony in an Anglican system, exactly the sort of thing for which I advocate.

    Christ Church, Berlin presently has bilingual services to accommodate the mix of attendees.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2022
  20. Shane R

    Shane R Well-Known Member

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    In the US, most of the Lutheran groups have what has come to be called the "Common Service," which is about 80% copied from the BCP. There are a couple of synods that have translations of the Scandinavian liturgies, in fact I have an English printing of the Swedish ordinal for making a bishop. Luther's "Chorale Mass" is also generally included in the service books, which oddly does not have a setting of the Creed.
     
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